Thanks to E.A. Blair for suggesting this wonderful new product...and illustration. We're planning on introducing more of your favorite wingers on Flakies boxes because...well, because every wingnut deserves the recognition.
Let ...
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___
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___
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FoxNation carried the piece about Anderson Cooper opening up and stating that he’s gay. That bit of news prompted the following comment from a conservative reader.
Well I don’t get into personal attacks. I’m a Conservative. I lean toward the facts.
The Facts are if you attracted to others of the same gender, you are a homosexual. Age doesn’t matter.
Cooper – Sandusky. Same thing. They both are attracted to people of the same gender.
It’s stuff like this that keeps reminding me that stupid can’t be fixed. If one is of the belief that there is no difference between homosexuals and child molesters then I imagine that there is not much one could say to dissuade the idiots from their bigoted and ignorant views. I’ve wasted too much precious time ‘debating’ matters of this sort with homophobic, racist morons. It’s just not worth the effort. It’s best to simply call them out, ignore their continuing rants and then use the voting booth to elect public officials willing to enact legislation that prevents the scum from infecting a civil society beyond what they already have.
Anyone who can say with a straight face that conservatives “lean toward the facts” and there is no difference between a gay man and a child molester is not worth the spit they so deserve.
Mario, if people check with the law enforcement folks, an interesting fact appears. According to crime statistics and the experience of law enforcement personnel, the highest percentage of rape, child abuse, sexual abuse, domestic violence and pedophilia comes from……..white, heterosexual, married, middle and upper class males!! The lowest level of such dangers come from two categories, lesbians and other mothers of small children! Now let those guys go figure that one out!
You’re absolutely right, Melody. Sadly, as I pointed out, these people don’t deal with facts. The person I quoted in the post actually stated that he “leans toward the facts’ so any other ‘facts’ that are presented to him that counter his beliefs are ignored. We’d have better luck debating with a brick wall than people of his type.
Who is the conservative asshat who said that? because any idiot who says crap like that needs to be identified in bold capital letters for the entire world to jeer at.
How do people of this mindset explain male child molesters who only molest little girls, or female molesters who prey on little boys? I don’t think they have thought this thing through very well!
Charlie, they don’t even try to ‘justify’ their stupidity. The only time they get bent out of shape when a teacher molests a student is when it’s a same sex situation. Another mystery to try to understand. They’re wackoo, simple.
In the 1880s (which means getting back to the times conservatives yearn for), the age of consent in most states was from ten to twelve years (the New York Times reported that as late as 1897, the age of consent in Delaware was seven years). Between 1885 and 1920, social reformers managed to raise the age of consent in most states to between sixteen and eighteen years.
By contrast, the marriage age in most states is below the age of consent; six states (including California) have no minimum statutory marriagable age (in New Hampshire, it’s thirteen for boys and twelve for girls). Granted that in most locations, the very young require the consent of their parents and, in some cases, a judge, in order to marry, but there are exceptions. In Texas, the state that wants to sanction stupidity as a national sport, a girl of fourteen can get married without needing parental or judicial permission provided she has already been married and divorced.
The point is that what is now reprehensible was once legal and commonplace, even though conservatives like to pretend that society hasn’t changed. A hundred and ten years ago, the big scandal with Sandusky would not have been the ages of his victims, but the fact that they were boys.
When I was a kid, I never heard a word spoken about homosexuality. I don’t even think I was aware of such a thing until I was in high school. Now, free gay-oriented newspapers are available to pick up in local supermarkets and street boxes. It’s no longer a big thing for someone to be gay – unless you’re a conservative. However, it’s knowing that there are people like the Fux News commenter cited above who sincerely believe as they do that also force me to conclude that we still have a long way to go.
My maternal grandmother was born in Kentucky in the year 1859, she was married at the age of 14 to a man who was 9 years her senior. I suppose that today my grandfather would be considered a child molester. What he did was commonplace back then.
Charlie, there are eleven states where such a marriage could still be legal today. I find it rather amusing that in every one of the fifty states, it would be possible to legally marry someone young enough that you could be busted for child pornography for having an intimate photo of your own spouse. There are also twenty states where it is legal to marry someone who is under the age of consent. I have no idea what the laws of those states have to say about consensual sex between spouses where one or both is underage, nor what happens if they move to a state with different laws.
What this does is show how conflicted and messed up our legal system and our society are when it comes to sex and marriage. People like the commenter who automatically equate homosexuality with pedophilia (or, for that matter, ephebophilia) while at the same time failing to recognize that a majority of child molestation cases are both heterosexual and within the circle of family or friends are the ones who are really sick.
Hello E. A.
I read what you wrote in some of your earlier comments on the health scare you endured for a long time in your life, and I’m glad you shared that part of you. I seem to meet mostly people that are disabled in various ways, on the internet. It’s a great source of communication to a world that is largely closed off to many that can’t really get out of their homes much, if at all.
Anyway, I just wanted to say, since I live in CA.
in California : If either of you is under eighteen (18) years of age, you will need to make an appointment with a counselor, appear before a superior court judge, show certified copies of your birth certificates, and have one parent appear with you when you apply for the marriage license.
You can marry under the age of 18 but with restrictions. The restrictions are designed to make sure there is no type of force to marry for either person. I have seen sites that claim there is no age limit of consent, but that just isn’t wholly true. We have a large population of Romano, many call them Gypsies, in my county, and they mostly marry young but through parental consent, even though this is their way of culture, to marry quite young, early teen years, they can’t without going through the court system first. I don’t know of any age consent by the courts for kids under the age of 14, myself, and I sure hope not, but maybe, possible, there could be exceptions.
Just sayin.
First I must say that Anderson Cooper coming out gay didn’t surprise me all that much, but I do have a lady friend who has a really big crush on Mr. Cooper; her heart will surely be broken over the news. Though she’s very open as far as gay men goes, she still a heterosexual woman who has spent many nights fantasizing about Anderson Cooper. Personally, I’m tickled pink – no pun intended.
As a gay man, I well know the narrow minds who would believe that because someone is gay, it makes them a pervert and in their books, a pervert will do anything – rape children, rape women – nothing is out of bounds.
Child molesters like Jerry Sandusky are a completely different breed. Most child molesters are also known to molest either male or female, as a child is a child, because that’s really what they’re attracted to, not usually any one sex.
Theyr’e attracted to innocence and that’s exactly what they rob from a child when they take advantage of them, intentionally or unintentionally.
Gay men, especially those who are out of the closet, are less likely to molest a child than a straight man, or like Jerry Sandusky,who was in the closet and instead of coming out of the closet, he has allowed his desires to be taken out on children.
Jerry should have sought help years ago when he realized that he was attracted to children but usually the shame keeps one from doing that. Maybe that needs to change and we need to be able to say to someone like Jerry, “Don’t wait until you find yourself acting out your fantasies but seek help instead.” Then make sure there is non-judgmental help for guys like him available.
My son is openly gay and has been for over twenty years. I can guarantee that neither he nor his spouse, he was married in San Francisco during a brief window of opportunity, would ever think about sexually abusing a child, they would come to the defense of any abused child instantly!
Jerry Sandusky is a homosexual AND a child molester
Correct me if I am wrong, but I know of no adult male relationships Sandusky has been involved in. In my opinion, he is just a child molester, a married child molester. Myself, I would not call him a homosexual because he seems to be inclined only to violate children. I don’t like calling him a homosexual because it would be like calling a man who violates 9 year old girls a heterosexual – not the point at all.
To better understand the mind of Republicans/Conservatives here’s something I found from 2008, and I’m quite sure that it applies today…..it’s in their DNA.
This is what Fox Noise, the GOP, and other RWNJ sites use as the catalyst to propel their zombie viewers to constantly swim in a state of fear.
You wrote (describing the situation in California): “If either of you is under eighteen (18) years of age, you will need to make an appointment with a counselor, appear before a superior court judge, show certified copies of your birth certificates, and have one parent appear with you when you apply for the marriage license.”
Note that I qualified my statement about underage marriage by saying, “Granted that in most locations, the very young require the consent of their parents and, in some cases, a judge, in order to marry, but there are exceptions.” It was not my intention to imply that such things were routine. But the possibility still exists. Take, for example, a case like Warren Jeffs and the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. They went off to a sparsely-populated county and built their own settlement where they could elect their own local goverment, including judges who could routinely be relied upon to approve applications for underage marriages.
However, by focusing on whether or not such marriages do occur, you seem to have missed my major point – and you can correct me if you think I’m wrong – that the laws governing such situations are absurd. They are a patchwork of oft-conflicting practtices, some of which are inheritances from the country’s earliest days, others which are the legacy of early twentieth-century social reform. I’ve already explained how I think it applies to the Sandusky/Cooper mismatch, but I’ll go a little further.
The United States is verging on another patchwork situation wherein states vary according to how whey legislate sexual conduct and marriage. The Texas GOP has explicitly stated, in their party platform, that they favor criminilization of homosexuality. With the kinds of social legislation (on marriage, abortion, contraception, to name a few) conservatives are trying to pass, their success or failure will determine whether we can continue to consider the US a unified country with any kind of cultural and social heritage. I’ll go a step further and veer off-topic by saying that the same is happening to health care. With states free to reject the Medicaid expansion provision of the ACA, your very quality of life will soon be determined by what side of a state line you live on and we will be no better off than we were under the Articles of Confederation.
You’re right – to be perfectly honest, I don’t know if Sandusky is a homosexual or not. In my zeal to pick apart the false analogy that was made by the “conservative reader” I made the (apparently false) assumption that (s)he was telling the truth.
I forgot that conservatives deceive on multiple levels.
I would like to insert a comment about Republicans and “Facts.”
If anyone has been watching for a few years, it becomes readily apparent that The Right Wing creates facts to fit their arguments. If a Real fact doesn’t work, then they make one!
This, I believe, is what sustains their fantasy-ridden Myth-Making Media – - – the ability to pluck “Facts” out of thin air like a magician when there are none. Smoke and Mirrors represents most “Facts” as recognized by far too many on The Right and The Right Extreme. Folks Snooze is a great example of how this fabricative propensity works in real time.
By the way has anyone noticed that The Right Wing seems to have revised their description of “Family and Moral Values” to make intolerance, stupidity, anger and hatred into virtues instead of vices?”
They often seem to live in a totally alternative universe.
John, I have often wondered if there is some kind of Republican Co-Ordinating Committee that meets every few days to plan the lies for the coming week, or what goes through what passes for a mind in the likes of a Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, Rush Limbaugh or Rick Santorum when they come up with all these off the wall things.
They all claim to be Christian but none of them hesitate to bear false witness.
Mr. E.A. (alias “anonymous” lol) Blair has a good point that I have been convinced is true.
Republicans definitely must be communicating in an organized “Co-Ordinating Committees” because they all are on the same talking points at any given time.
By everyone having the same talking points, in front of whatever media they come before, they repeat those points often enough to establish it as fact.
They basically are following the principle attributed to Nazi Master propagandist Joseph Goebbels -
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. ”
As infamous as Nazi’s and Goebbel’s have become in history, unfortunately, the principle has proven historically true. Republicans know this and use it daily, which is why they have dominated the “message war” much too often. The “Affordable Care Act” , for one, would never have been such a demonized piece of legislation by Republicans, if it wasn’t for this tactic.
Goebbel’s also addresses the reason this tactic works by saying :
“The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie.”
Since there is rarely any “consequences of the lie”, it enhances the effectiveness of the “lie” and the use of “lying” as Romney has shown during the entirety of his campaign.
It has come to the point, nowadays, that to obtain “truth” one must actively research and seek for it.
Mario, if people check with the law enforcement folks, an interesting fact appears. According to crime statistics and the experience of law enforcement personnel, the highest percentage of rape, child abuse, sexual abuse, domestic violence and pedophilia comes from……..white, heterosexual, married, middle and upper class males!! The lowest level of such dangers come from two categories, lesbians and other mothers of small children! Now let those guys go figure that one out!
You’re absolutely right, Melody. Sadly, as I pointed out, these people don’t deal with facts. The person I quoted in the post actually stated that he “leans toward the facts’ so any other ‘facts’ that are presented to him that counter his beliefs are ignored. We’d have better luck debating with a brick wall than people of his type.
Who is the conservative asshat who said that? because any idiot who says crap like that needs to be identified in bold capital letters for the entire world to jeer at.
How do people of this mindset explain male child molesters who only molest little girls, or female molesters who prey on little boys? I don’t think they have thought this thing through very well!
That’s just it, Charlie! That type of behavior doesn’t come from brilliant thinking!
Charlie, they don’t even try to ‘justify’ their stupidity. The only time they get bent out of shape when a teacher molests a student is when it’s a same sex situation. Another mystery to try to understand. They’re wackoo, simple.
In the 1880s (which means getting back to the times conservatives yearn for), the age of consent in most states was from ten to twelve years (the New York Times reported that as late as 1897, the age of consent in Delaware was seven years). Between 1885 and 1920, social reformers managed to raise the age of consent in most states to between sixteen and eighteen years.
By contrast, the marriage age in most states is below the age of consent; six states (including California) have no minimum statutory marriagable age (in New Hampshire, it’s thirteen for boys and twelve for girls). Granted that in most locations, the very young require the consent of their parents and, in some cases, a judge, in order to marry, but there are exceptions. In Texas, the state that wants to sanction stupidity as a national sport, a girl of fourteen can get married without needing parental or judicial permission provided she has already been married and divorced.
The point is that what is now reprehensible was once legal and commonplace, even though conservatives like to pretend that society hasn’t changed. A hundred and ten years ago, the big scandal with Sandusky would not have been the ages of his victims, but the fact that they were boys.
When I was a kid, I never heard a word spoken about homosexuality. I don’t even think I was aware of such a thing until I was in high school. Now, free gay-oriented newspapers are available to pick up in local supermarkets and street boxes. It’s no longer a big thing for someone to be gay – unless you’re a conservative. However, it’s knowing that there are people like the Fux News commenter cited above who sincerely believe as they do that also force me to conclude that we still have a long way to go.
My maternal grandmother was born in Kentucky in the year 1859, she was married at the age of 14 to a man who was 9 years her senior. I suppose that today my grandfather would be considered a child molester. What he did was commonplace back then.
Charlie, there are eleven states where such a marriage could still be legal today. I find it rather amusing that in every one of the fifty states, it would be possible to legally marry someone young enough that you could be busted for child pornography for having an intimate photo of your own spouse. There are also twenty states where it is legal to marry someone who is under the age of consent. I have no idea what the laws of those states have to say about consensual sex between spouses where one or both is underage, nor what happens if they move to a state with different laws.
What this does is show how conflicted and messed up our legal system and our society are when it comes to sex and marriage. People like the commenter who automatically equate homosexuality with pedophilia (or, for that matter, ephebophilia) while at the same time failing to recognize that a majority of child molestation cases are both heterosexual and within the circle of family or friends are the ones who are really sick.
Hello E. A.
I read what you wrote in some of your earlier comments on the health scare you endured for a long time in your life, and I’m glad you shared that part of you. I seem to meet mostly people that are disabled in various ways, on the internet. It’s a great source of communication to a world that is largely closed off to many that can’t really get out of their homes much, if at all.
Anyway, I just wanted to say, since I live in CA.
in California : If either of you is under eighteen (18) years of age, you will need to make an appointment with a counselor, appear before a superior court judge, show certified copies of your birth certificates, and have one parent appear with you when you apply for the marriage license.
You can marry under the age of 18 but with restrictions. The restrictions are designed to make sure there is no type of force to marry for either person. I have seen sites that claim there is no age limit of consent, but that just isn’t wholly true. We have a large population of Romano, many call them Gypsies, in my county, and they mostly marry young but through parental consent, even though this is their way of culture, to marry quite young, early teen years, they can’t without going through the court system first. I don’t know of any age consent by the courts for kids under the age of 14, myself, and I sure hope not, but maybe, possible, there could be exceptions.
Just sayin.
First I must say that Anderson Cooper coming out gay didn’t surprise me all that much, but I do have a lady friend who has a really big crush on Mr. Cooper; her heart will surely be broken over the news. Though she’s very open as far as gay men goes, she still a heterosexual woman who has spent many nights fantasizing about Anderson Cooper. Personally, I’m tickled pink – no pun intended.
As a gay man, I well know the narrow minds who would believe that because someone is gay, it makes them a pervert and in their books, a pervert will do anything – rape children, rape women – nothing is out of bounds.
Child molesters like Jerry Sandusky are a completely different breed. Most child molesters are also known to molest either male or female, as a child is a child, because that’s really what they’re attracted to, not usually any one sex.
Theyr’e attracted to innocence and that’s exactly what they rob from a child when they take advantage of them, intentionally or unintentionally.
Gay men, especially those who are out of the closet, are less likely to molest a child than a straight man, or like Jerry Sandusky,who was in the closet and instead of coming out of the closet, he has allowed his desires to be taken out on children.
Jerry should have sought help years ago when he realized that he was attracted to children but usually the shame keeps one from doing that. Maybe that needs to change and we need to be able to say to someone like Jerry, “Don’t wait until you find yourself acting out your fantasies but seek help instead.” Then make sure there is non-judgmental help for guys like him available.
Besides the fact that I nearly burst out laughing when I read “I’m a Conservative. I lean toward the facts.”………..
It’s just another right wing attempt to make homosexual = pedophile.
How about these for facts:
- Anderson Cooper is a homosexual
- Jerry Sandusky is a homosexual AND a child molester
Dear Conservatives: Those are TWO DIFFERENT THINGS.
My son is openly gay and has been for over twenty years. I can guarantee that neither he nor his spouse, he was married in San Francisco during a brief window of opportunity, would ever think about sexually abusing a child, they would come to the defense of any abused child instantly!
Correct me if I am wrong, but I know of no adult male relationships Sandusky has been involved in. In my opinion, he is just a child molester, a married child molester. Myself, I would not call him a homosexual because he seems to be inclined only to violate children. I don’t like calling him a homosexual because it would be like calling a man who violates 9 year old girls a heterosexual – not the point at all.
Not to mince words.
To better understand the mind of Republicans/Conservatives here’s something I found from 2008, and I’m quite sure that it applies today…..it’s in their DNA.
This is what Fox Noise, the GOP, and other RWNJ sites use as the catalyst to propel their zombie viewers to constantly swim in a state of fear.
F…..FALSE
E….EVENTS
A….APPEARING
R….REAL
I just have to post this pic, it’s way too funny!
@Jan – Oh, if only…
@Anonymous:
You wrote (describing the situation in California): “If either of you is under eighteen (18) years of age, you will need to make an appointment with a counselor, appear before a superior court judge, show certified copies of your birth certificates, and have one parent appear with you when you apply for the marriage license.”
Note that I qualified my statement about underage marriage by saying, “Granted that in most locations, the very young require the consent of their parents and, in some cases, a judge, in order to marry, but there are exceptions.” It was not my intention to imply that such things were routine. But the possibility still exists. Take, for example, a case like Warren Jeffs and the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. They went off to a sparsely-populated county and built their own settlement where they could elect their own local goverment, including judges who could routinely be relied upon to approve applications for underage marriages.
However, by focusing on whether or not such marriages do occur, you seem to have missed my major point – and you can correct me if you think I’m wrong – that the laws governing such situations are absurd. They are a patchwork of oft-conflicting practtices, some of which are inheritances from the country’s earliest days, others which are the legacy of early twentieth-century social reform. I’ve already explained how I think it applies to the Sandusky/Cooper mismatch, but I’ll go a little further.
The United States is verging on another patchwork situation wherein states vary according to how whey legislate sexual conduct and marriage. The Texas GOP has explicitly stated, in their party platform, that they favor criminilization of homosexuality. With the kinds of social legislation (on marriage, abortion, contraception, to name a few) conservatives are trying to pass, their success or failure will determine whether we can continue to consider the US a unified country with any kind of cultural and social heritage. I’ll go a step further and veer off-topic by saying that the same is happening to health care. With states free to reject the Medicaid expansion provision of the ACA, your very quality of life will soon be determined by what side of a state line you live on and we will be no better off than we were under the Articles of Confederation.
OC Liberal:
You’re right – to be perfectly honest, I don’t know if Sandusky is a homosexual or not. In my zeal to pick apart the false analogy that was made by the “conservative reader” I made the (apparently false) assumption that (s)he was telling the truth.
I forgot that conservatives deceive on multiple levels.
The Republican Party came out against something they claim they stand for. “Personal Responsibility”, just to oppose “ObamaCare” Not surprising.
I would like to insert a comment about Republicans and “Facts.”
If anyone has been watching for a few years, it becomes readily apparent that The Right Wing creates facts to fit their arguments. If a Real fact doesn’t work, then they make one!
This, I believe, is what sustains their fantasy-ridden Myth-Making Media – - – the ability to pluck “Facts” out of thin air like a magician when there are none. Smoke and Mirrors represents most “Facts” as recognized by far too many on The Right and The Right Extreme. Folks Snooze is a great example of how this fabricative propensity works in real time.
By the way has anyone noticed that The Right Wing seems to have revised their description of “Family and Moral Values” to make intolerance, stupidity, anger and hatred into virtues instead of vices?”
They often seem to live in a totally alternative universe.
John, I have often wondered if there is some kind of Republican Co-Ordinating Committee that meets every few days to plan the lies for the coming week, or what goes through what passes for a mind in the likes of a Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, Rush Limbaugh or Rick Santorum when they come up with all these off the wall things.
They all claim to be Christian but none of them hesitate to bear false witness.
Mr. E.A. (alias “anonymous” lol) Blair has a good point that I have been convinced is true.
Republicans definitely must be communicating in an organized “Co-Ordinating Committees” because they all are on the same talking points at any given time.
By everyone having the same talking points, in front of whatever media they come before, they repeat those points often enough to establish it as fact.
They basically are following the principle attributed to Nazi Master propagandist Joseph Goebbels -
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. ”
As infamous as Nazi’s and Goebbel’s have become in history, unfortunately, the principle has proven historically true. Republicans know this and use it daily, which is why they have dominated the “message war” much too often. The “Affordable Care Act” , for one, would never have been such a demonized piece of legislation by Republicans, if it wasn’t for this tactic.
Goebbel’s also addresses the reason this tactic works by saying :
“The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie.”
Since there is rarely any “consequences of the lie”, it enhances the effectiveness of the “lie” and the use of “lying” as Romney has shown during the entirety of his campaign.
It has come to the point, nowadays, that to obtain “truth” one must actively research and seek for it.