From a political party overflowing with sociopaths and creeps, none other than Dick Cheney encapsulates to a greater degree what it is the Republican party has become. The blood of ...
It can be debated as to whether the filibuster came about as a political accident or was created to give minority parties a stronger say in opposing specific legislation they ...
While gun nuts sink a little deeper into madness with each passing day, Seattle is turning guns into bricks.
The Seattle Police Department collected more than 700 guns during a buyback ...
Had enough of right-wing political crap and find yourself with a deep desire to get as far from the madding crowd as you can?
Read on...
The opportunity to travel to Mars ...
Here's the full quote from Charles P. Pierce.
If your "way of life" involves handing deadly weapons to five-year olds, your way of life is completely screwed up and you should ...
A guest post from James Fidlerten.
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After September 11, 2011, America became united, as it grieved the loss of so many lives on American soil. The tragic event also changed so ...
I'm not sure that 'crazy' is strong enough an adjective to describe the many (or few) who go to the absurd lengths they do in defending America's out-of-control gun culture. ...
When an enabler of sexual abuse directed at children sits on the threshold of sainthood, you know you're living in a world of screwed-up priorities.
The canonisation of Wojtyla is getting ...
Retired Justice Sandra Day O'Connor, ponders Bush v. Gore, the Supreme Court case that decided the 2000 presidential election.
Looking back, O'Connor said, she isn't sure the high court should have ...
Barbara Bush on a Jeb run in 2016.
"We've had enough Bushes."
An entire planet concurs.
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Today we learn...
The 19-year-old suspect in the Boston Marathon bombings has told interrogators that the American wars in Iraq and Afghanistan motivated him and his brother to carry out the ...
The above is in response to Maureen Dowd's ridiculous assertion that President Obama is incompetent for failing to get the 60 votes the Senate required to move the gun background ...
In desperate need of an excuse for voting against background checks, here's the one an unnamed Democratic senator is using.
“Guns, gays and immigration — it’s too much. I can be ...
The vote came in at 55 to 45 in favor of expanding background checks for gun sales. In most institutes of democracy, that would have been more than enough to ...
Even for Louie Gohmert apologists who can't quite grasp the fact that the man is a complete moron whose Idiot Quotient rivals that of Michele Bachmann, it has to be ...
Exactly.
Boston. Fucking horrible.
I remember, when 9/11 went down, my reaction was, "Well, I've had it with humanity."
But I was wrong. I don't know what's going to be revealed to be ...
Less than 24 hours after the tragedy at Boston and without a clue as to whom the perpetrator might be, the bigots have crawled out from under the rocks they ...
When did ignorance become
a point of view? ~Dilbert
Is it time yet to make a double-digit IQ a prerequisite to running for public office?
Via Foolocracy:
Texas Rep. Joe Barton doesn’t believe ...
Have you seen this bit of mind-numbing drivel from Fox and Friends yet? Some idiot thought it would be a wonderful idea to bring on a 4-year old girl and her 7-year old sister to make the case that President Obama is anti-business. Brian Kilmeade introduced the two girls as entrepreneurs who are running a lemonade stand without government assistance and (he actually said this), “without any help.”
Here, just watch it. WARNING: Cringe Alert is in effect (e.g. the 7-year old says that she can’t give the recipe for the lemonade because it is “proprietary” information. Sheesh.)
Just when you thought that Fox could not sink any lower, they embarrass themselves with stupidity of this sort. The irony of this sad spectacle is that the girls lend credence to exactly what the President said. They had help in starting their ‘business’ from their “investors” (dad, stepmom and others). Also, of course, there would be no lemonade stand without the roads and sidewalks to get people to the stand and there would be no actual lemonade without the water filtration plants to purify the water. And let’s not get into the lemons which were grown in orchards by farmers who probably operate because of government subsidies. Nor, I imagine, should we mention the schools that teach 7-year olds how to write words like ‘L-E-M-O-N-A-D-E’.
The only positive coming out of all this was that Fox viewers got to listen to guests who matched not only their level of knowledge, but that of the hosts as well. As for IQ, I suspect that the young girls had both viewers and hosts beat.
___
Admit that Obama made a stupid comment and should be advised to stay with the teleprompter the next time he opens up his mouth. I’ll admit that the Fox and Friends segment was silly but it was done so purposely to match the president’s words.
I read quite well, thank you. My hearing is equally functional. Obama clearly said that business owners did not build their enterprise. Is comprehension a problem for you, Dario?
Redstate girl….you have never posted one truthful thing on this site. You are the poster child for the brainwashed masses that are incapable of an origional thought and common sense . You just open your mouth while they shovel in the propaganda and it goes directly to what is left of your brain. I am sorry if this comes across harsh, but there are many thoughtful, intelligent posters who visit this website who know the facts and you have zero chance of dragging one of us into your bubble.
Maybe it would be a good exercise for you to think that maybe, just maybe the republicans are lying sacks of shite. And their lying to you.
What is the matter with you all? I’ve tried to refrain from believing that all liberals are in need of mental help but you people make it difficult to keep that belief going. Watch the video above. Listen as Obama says, “If you got a business, you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.”
I’m am trying to understand liberal thinking which is the only reason I come to this site but you people are delusional. You deny facts when they’re right in front of your eyes. You have a video with the president saying something which is very clear to everyone but you still claim that he did not say what it is he said.
The republicans cut off what he said before that line. He started off saying that nobody makes it completely on their own, and as an example he said that the government system and tax payers put in place a society ( with laws, police, public education, roads, highways, bridges, satilites used by private industry, thr world wide web develooed by nasa and the militery and handed to private industry to orofit from,ect. And then he said that the business owners did not pay for those things by themselves. The repubs cut that out in order to fool people like you. Now think about this….think of some big corporations, Johnson & Johnson, catipiller, auto industry, apple, IBM, AT&T, tmobile, wells Fargo, bank of America, and so on and so on. They set up their private businesses using government investments. They didn’t spend any money developing a judicial system that would protect the contracts they signed, they didn’t develope and sent up satilites, they didn’t, on their own initiative using their money build roads, highways, bridges. The government did that. The government made the investments needed for private people to set up businesses, and more investments that guaranteed them that customers would be available to them. Now it has always been a given that when someone makes an investment, they should be compensated for that, private industry certainly expects to be compensated for their investments. Now remember when we talk about the government, we are talking about the people who have lived and now live in America. When we talk about investments, we are talking about our tax dollars, spent for the purpose to give opportunity to its citizens. Reagan was wrong….government is not and never was the “problem”. For the people, by the people. THE GOVERNMENT IS US.
It is so obvious that you are here trolling the libs (get them agitated for sport). You get the idea that the line is taken out of context with the intent of distorting the President’s words for a soundbite. You also have seen the clips of Romney saying exactly the same thing during the Olympics in Utah. It is called POLITICS, not to be confused with POLICY. I doubt you are that stupid.
This is a non issue, whipped up to reinforce the conservative narrative that Obama is a Socialist. Well, you know what, I am fine with you people thinking that. If you really think Romney will be better for the middle class, VOTE FOR THE DOUCHE BAG – just like you voted for the village idiot W.
But when you do, do us all a favor and don’t blame Democrats for the fucked economy like you are now with Obama. Instead, activate whatever cognitive abilities you possess and put the blame where it belongs: the Republican Party – the anti-Socialist, Darwinian, Libertarian, sink-or-swim party of the Plutocracy.
Trickle Down might seem alright until you realize that warm, wet feeling is the Republican Party PISSING ON YOUR FOOT!
OC…..maybe when these republican supporters end up working for $3.00/hr, and are living under our crumbling bridges with their uneducated, hungry children, they will listen to their GOP leaders proudly brag the the USA is the wealthiest nation on the globe and they will realize that they were duped.
No, Sydney, they never will. They willl be told it was the fault of birth control, abortions, gay marriage, equal rights, etc. – and they, like redstategirl, will believe it.
How interesting that not one of you libs have anything to say about the actual words Obama said as quoted by Redstategirl. “If you got a business, you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.”
Seems pretty clear to most of us what it was the president was saying. A little honesty on the part of liberals would go a long way in bridging the divide between left and right. Give it a go. You might even learn that factual honesty could sometimes be your friend.
Cheryl you are probley correct. When I read posts on various sites that are frequented by teapots, I have been noticing them telling others how lucky they are to have found a part time minimum wage job. They will say that they thank god for this blessing because there a so many people who can’t find a job at all. So…….just like the conservatives have convinced us that mass shooting with automatic weapons, is just something that happens once in a while, and there will always be some crazy people that will commit these crimes, many people have started to accept these incidences as common place and there is nothing we can do about it as this is the price we, as Americans, pay for FREEDOM. A future republican government will convince their sheep that, by god, they are lucky to get that poverty level job! People in china are only making $1.40/hr, so god bless America…..your making $3.00!!! The repubs have an amazing ability to control the conversation, or lack there of, and there is no limit to the uneducated, gullible and racist Americans that will believe their crap. I think we just might be up shits creek.
Marcus
The word THAT refers to the previous remark regarding this society that had been created through government projects and Americans tax dollars.
Example…
If Obama said ” the republicans in congress refuse to extend tax relief for the middle class, so what the republicans are saying to the American people is this…………everyone’s taxes will go up, your government does not care about your plight, tuff luck to 99% of the population, just tighten your belts”
Ok now…….
The GOP would replay over and over Obama only speaking speaking the following ” EVERYONE’S taxes will go up, your government does not care about your plight, tuff luck to the 99% of the population, just tighten your belts”
“Misleading” is in the eye of the beholder. I understand full well why you would interpret the president’s words as you have but you should be aware that you are making an assumption. Obama is your guy and you choose to give him the benefit of the doubt as to what he meant by “that”. Very well. As an independent, I see it differently.
@Marcus. You didn’t listen to the actual speech – only what Fox took out of context. He was talking about the infrastructure. You have to get off Fox to hear the real stuff.
OK, let’s say Obama said what you think ( I think he was talking about the importance of community and society as an institution). How do you respond to Romney making the same statement at the Olympics?
Though I salute the many friends on this site’s steadfast defense of the President, Marcus and Redstate girl are right about one thing .. he did speak those words.
That being said, anyone paying attention to the political campaign’s of both party’s would instinctively know the President was giving a, less than eloquent version (by his standards), of Elizabeth Warren’s now well known speech which went viral on youtube.
In which she points out that America is “indivisble” and therefore the rich, the poor, the middle class – all are helped by someone, some organization and many times by our government. To deny THAT is “delusional”.
For anyone to grasp on to a few words, clearly taken out of context, and make a national campaign about it, speaks volumes of how divisive our politics has become and the lack of substance some people are willing to accept.
It is always a wonder to me how Republicans could go from believing as Lincoln when he said government “is BY the people FOR the people… and shall not perish” – to believing that “government” is an evil entity to be “drowned in a bathtub”.
All of us must continue to realize, that this election is truly about the FUTURE we want for our country.
Yes we ALL say we want it to be prosperous and strong and “exceptional”, but how do we get there?
By throwing our poor. disabled, seniors and children under the bus along with much of the middle class, to give more to the rich ? That approach has shown to be a major FAILURE, not only in the US but in Europe….
or to build from the middle class out – as we have successfully done in the past, by providing them the tools necessary that will eventually enrich ALL of our citizens and make our Nation strong.
Fighting over a few words while faced with THAT decision… seems small in comparison.
By the way, Marcus D, You aren’t an Independent. People who support the idea of Democrats being taken out of context in an effort to prove they are Socialists are called CONSERVATIVES. But thanks for playing our game. Enjoy the Rice-a-Roni.
I listened to the speech. The conservatives present a theory, then they must invent evidence to promote their theory.
Obama was going to take everyone’s guns. Oh, that didn’t happen? Well if he gets a second term that’s when he will do it. Obama wants to become a dictator, is a Muslim, he is ashamed of America, he had an apology tour, he hates business, he hates Americans, his goal is to destroy this country, I could go on and on. All of these conspiracy theories never came to pass. Obama is what he is, an intelligent, thoughtful man who want the best for the people who elected him. He takes his job seriously, thinks before he acts, and makes decisions based on reality.
Now do you really believe that he slipped up and let the real Obama shine through, his devious plan accidentally exposed for all to see? The man was the head of the Harvard law review. Bush was such a dunce that they were able to print over 4 books that documented his bushisims. I was embarrassed for him just watching the word salad that tumbled from his mouth. Romney….I like firing people…..I’m not concerned about the very poor….and Ann Romney…..we have given you PEOPLE all you need to know about our finances. We are the people. In 2009 over 30,000 citizens were given amnesty when they were caught and charged with tax evasion for money placed in Swiss bank accounts. Could that be the reason he won’t release his tax records?this country is so divided that Romney could bite the eyeball out of a infant at one of his rally’s, and. That would be OK.
Well said, GoldenSun. Thank you for clarifying the intent of the President’s statement which was taken out of context. Also, I agree with you about the future we want for this country — for everyone to have an equal opportunity to prosper. “Trickle Down” economics doesn’t work — the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, and the middle class disappear altogether.
When Bush took office we had a budget surplus. When he left office, our economy was in the toilet — due largely to a lengthy drawn out war started over a false premise. Despite roadblocks thrown into his path by the GOP at every turn, President Obama has steadfastly worked toward righting those wrongs and getting the country back on its feet since he took office. This country can’t survive another hit like it took during the Bush years, so I will be casting my vote again for Barack Obama in 2012!
I want to jump back in here and remind everyone that we don’t have to go back as far as the Olympics…after Romney condemned the President as “FOREIGN” for his ALLEGED words, he went on, in the very same stump speech, to AGREE with all that the President ACTUALLY said…too bad no one in the audience had seen the President’s remarks and could realize their candidate’s concession.
Sydney…”Obama is what he is….” and he wants the BEST FOR ALL THE PEOPLE (remember when he said “to those of you who didn’t vote for me, I’ll be YOUR President too”), not just the ones who elected him. He knows full well that if the “working people” (currently referred to as the “middle class”) do well, if the economy grows from the bottom up (currently described as the “middle out”), EVEN THE WEALTHY make more money.
It appears we’ve lost redState girl…sadly, she’s missed much wisdom in the recent comments. If her goal was to rile up, cudos to her. The byproduct is to cement our support for the President, to remind ourselves to do MORE of what we can to assure this President has a second term…then think hard about who will follow him…this mess won’t be over for years to come unless we keep supporting our POLICIES, knowing that they are all that stands between US and PLUTOCRACY…we must, for posterity AND the future, stand strong to rebuild this nation on progressive values.
Even that guy in New Hampshire that Romney used, Jack Gilchrist, admits to having had government help. Here is the information:
In 1999, Gilchrist Metal received $800,000 in tax-exempt revenue bonds issued by the New Hampshire Business Finance Authority “to set up a second manufacturing plant and purchase equipment to produce high definition television broadcasting equipment,” according to a New Hampshire Union Leader report at the time…
Gilchrist wisely took advantage of these funds, which help small businesses like his survive in their early years. He also took a U.S. Small Business Administration loan in the late 1980s totaling “somewhere south of” $500,000, plus matching funds from the federally-funded New England Trade Adjustment Assistance Center.
In a lesson on basic government spending that Romney himself could learn from, Gilchrist succinctly explained: “I’m not going to turn a blind eye because the money came from the government. As far as I’m concerned, I’m getting some of my tax money back. I’m not stupid, I’m not going to say ‘no.’ Shame on me if I didn’t use what’s available.”
In other words, he didn’t do it himself. He had government help. He didn’t build it alone..
So tell me, redState girl – If the Presiden is a liar, is Romney not also a liar? Is Gilchrist a hypocrite for appearing in that commercial and saying what he did? Are you not a parrot sounding off with Fox News talking points? Does the Republican Party and their supporters have a flaming case of ODS because there’s a ni black man in the woodpi White House
Let me add that I’ve been involved with OFA from the start…and urge those of you here who yearn for a second term to contact your state OFA representatives and offer your support and some of your time to the ’12 campaign….visit barackobama.com or OrganizingforAmerica.com for contacts. Your articulateness and passion can help this President WIN.
I now live, as an adopted “native”, in the Wild and Wonderful state of WV…the slogan speaks the truth…”wonderful” in the bounty of her natural beauty, “wild” when talking guns, race, LIBERTY or FREEDOM.
We are considered a “border state”, along with all the others surrounding “the 12″ or “the 9″…whatever number you consider to be the battleground. (Don’t tell anyone but, our D voters, at upwards of 40%, in the recent primary, voted to elect a convicted felon currently incarcerated in TX, who has run before on other ballots, rather than support Obama…I’ll let you conclude as you will but hint that he’s not BLACK, MUSLIM or NAZI…).
Rest assured there is a “small but mighty” group of dedicated Progressives, even Liberals, among the Dem voters in our state. Some of us are working hard making voter calls into Ohio…I find voters are discouraged and disheartened…even the President admits he didn’t do a good enough job of telling the STORY of what and why he pursues the policies he has…or how it RELATES personally to OUR lives….none of the Dems did WELL ENOUGH at countering the R SPIN.
Making calls can be frustrating, irritating and REWARDING…for those voters who WANT to support a second term and yet, feel the President hasn’t done enough for them, we need to listen, remind them of what he HAS been able to accomplish for THEM and provide support before we ask for their support in Nov. We’re using a highly efficient (consider the source) online system…you can call in your undies with a “cup of Joe”, at your convenience…stop and start as your busy schedule allows.
PLEASE CONSIDER JOINING US…YOUR VOICE COULD MAKE ALL THE DIFFERENCE.
One more thing…a friend emailed a link to Mario…I was blown away by the talent in the illustrations and find comfort in (most of) the words here…thank you all for allowing me to bust into your conversations.
You “should” check out my friend, Chris Savage’s blog, eclectablog.com…especially after today’s conversation.
Find this entry….Romney resorts to Breitbart-style editing in latest attack against Obama (UPDATED x2)
Thanks so much GS….I’ll pop in as often as possible. I “lurk” at and support a couple of blogs and seldom enter the conversations because my time is limited but it felt right jumping in here.
I’ll bet tomorrow we’ll be talking about the President’s Urban League speech…where he mentioned, wait for it…… GUNS.
redState girl – I believe that liberals make economic decisions based on a false premise. They believe that the economy starts with consumers. They believe that if the government gives money to consumers, companies will have more customers, and will therefore have a reason to expand.
It’s that single belief that guides them to redistribute wealth. It’s the reason they want to take more from the rich and give it to the poor. They think that the economy starts with money magically appearing in someone’s pocket.
I know, as do most small business owners, that the economy starts with someone creating a product or service that they can market and sell. They create the demand for their businesses with advertising. They don’t wait for customers to come, they pull them in. They create demand, they don’t wait for demand.
Every individual is a small business too. They market their time and skills to potential employers until someone agrees to pay the individual’s asking price. Employers are customers of the employee.
Small businesses contract with vendors to supply them with the raw materials they need to deliver what they’re offering to their customers. The “help” that was given by those vendors to the business owner, was voluntarily provided by each of them so they could earn a profit. They didn’t do it on behalf of some “social contract”.
Tax revenues are only generated when there’s profit. When my company makes a profit, I pay taxes. My employees pay taxes on the profits they receive from supplying my company with their time and skills.
It’s the profits that result from the use of sound business practices that generate the tax revenues that pay for the roads and bridges that are used to transport all of this commerce. The government doesn’t provide services out of some sense of compassion. We buy the products that they’re selling. Every service provided by a teacher, a policeman, or a fireman, is bought and paid for out of the profits generated in a free market environment.
The economy starts with people who create demand for what they’re selling. To tell people anything else, robs them of any hope that they can do anything to change their situation. It then becomes easy for governmental entrepreneurs, (who just want to increase their own market share), to feed the people hope with a promise that they’ll work to take from the rich, and give to them.
As long as people keep making economic decisions based on incorrect assumptions, the economy will suffer.
Dear Mr. Pane, good to hear from you again ! I must rebut your post by saying:
Talk about incorrect assumptions, your whole diatribe started out with the false assumption that
“the government GIVES money to consumers”. Where did that come from?
You confuse the “starting of a business” with “stimulating” the economy. Something that would benefit all businesses.
I’m all for small businesses and I often wish the big conglomerates would be replaced by more of them, – but the economy is not suffering from a LACK of people wanting to sell something to them.
The problem is these businesses that originated in the US, that accepted government help with loans, with subsidies, with tax cuts, with favorable regulation and many other things that help them establish themselves and become successful now multi-national corporations, started taking advantage of all the above.
While all assumed they would create jobs in America and help the economy, they now outsource their jobs because of cheaper labor and MORE profits.
They now abuse the tax laws and actually pay our politicians to create even more favorable laws, to the point where total tax evasion has become legal.
So all those “raw materials, vendors and tax revenues and jobs”, now go to a foreign country. And though there are still many places of businesses here, the ever growing number of (150 million estimated) American potential workers are left to “market” themselves to fewer and fewer of them and, as we know, many are left without.
Those that are lucky enough to have jobs find that (as economy 101 tells us) the more supply of workers there is the less demand for them there is and the cheaper the price for American workers will become. Thus more and more Americans work for minimum wage.
This results in the national “consumer” having less to spend on the products you sell, which may mean you may have to sell those products at a cheaper rate, which means less profits for you which means less taxes going to “Build” those roads, bridges and other infrastructure.
I don’t know what you “produce” or how large your “small business” may be, but this President has provided many incentives to keep you profitable.
Your hatred of paying taxes, however seems more of a principle ideology of yours, than any physical effect on your own personal profits.
You and I agree on one thing however – “As long as people keep making economic decisions based on incorrect assumptions, the economy will suffer.”
Tommy
I am a small business owner. Have been for over 25 years. Meat industry. Highly regulated business. I know MANY other business owners. Business owners are friends of mine. EVERY SINGLE ONE would tell you that without customers….you got nothing. You can make a wonderful product! You can advertise your product! People will find that they DON’T WANT TO LIVE without your product!, until they, themselves, lose their jobs, homes, and security and they HAVE to live without your product. Even APPLE will one day find that the customers who lost their revenue due to job loss, will discover that can live without that $500. IPhone.
You don’t know what your talking about tommy. You drank the koolaid and that koolaid filled your brain to the point that reasonable thought cannot exist. When people lose their jobs and their wallets do not contain the disposable cash that it once did, they spend just what they need to survive. Most families will not use the republican theory of economics. A family of four in which the parents lost their jobs would look desperately for new revenue, and unlike the conservative ideology of cutting expenses by cutting Medicare, education funding, social security, public service workers, the parents WILL NOT try to fix their finances by getting rid of their children (kids cost alot of money tommy),sell their furniture, car, televisions and just try to hang on to their home by their fingernails. They will try their best to bring in new revenue.
No business owner ever made a decision based on their tax rates. I paid more in taxes then most people made in a year. 23-30 thousand. I moved into a bigger building, hired more help, invested in the stock market and real estate.
After the republican ideology crashed the economy in 08, my customers were hit hard. At first they continued to come weekly, but spent less money, then they visited monthly and spent even less money. I looked to move to a smaller, cheaper building and let go of my employees. Then many of my customers lost their homes, moved away, and I never saw them again. The business that I had run so profitably for decades is a shadow of its former self.
Ayn Rand wrote fiction tommy. A woman who railed against the government her entire life, used Medicare and SS, under a different name at the end of her life.
Although I would like to believe that the government spend money on public education, infrasture, medical research, technical research (which in many cases they turned over to private entities for personal profit), did these things solely out if compassion I realize that the government borrowed money and did these things as an investment.
The judicial and legal system which allowed me to enforce signed contracts is an investment they made that benefits me. This democracy which was an experiment of government run by, and representing its citizens was very successful. We did amazing things, wonderful things, we built the Hoover dam, interstate highways, jet engines, satilites, the world wide web. The bones of this country was an investment by the people living here for the people yet to be born. The government doesn’t deserve a return on its investment by all who profit from it?
Your vision of how the economy works is a fallacy, and I would imagine that you would have to see it fail with your own eyes to realize that.
Fox finally puts on guests who match the intellect of their viewers. What’s wrong with that?
Admit that Obama made a stupid comment and should be advised to stay with the teleprompter the next time he opens up his mouth. I’ll admit that the Fox and Friends segment was silly but it was done so purposely to match the president’s words.
redStategirl. Is reading comprehension a problem for you? Try reading the President’s words before mouthing off slop.
I read quite well, thank you. My hearing is equally functional. Obama clearly said that business owners did not build their enterprise. Is comprehension a problem for you, Dario?
Redstate girl….you have never posted one truthful thing on this site. You are the poster child for the brainwashed masses that are incapable of an origional thought and common sense . You just open your mouth while they shovel in the propaganda and it goes directly to what is left of your brain. I am sorry if this comes across harsh, but there are many thoughtful, intelligent posters who visit this website who know the facts and you have zero chance of dragging one of us into your bubble.
Maybe it would be a good exercise for you to think that maybe, just maybe the republicans are lying sacks of shite. And their lying to you.
Will someone please send redState girl the video?
The best line in THIS video is the host saying “Wow, this is quite a setup.”
I’m with Eliza…yawn.
What is the matter with you all? I’ve tried to refrain from believing that all liberals are in need of mental help but you people make it difficult to keep that belief going. Watch the video above. Listen as Obama says, “If you got a business, you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.”
I’m am trying to understand liberal thinking which is the only reason I come to this site but you people are delusional. You deny facts when they’re right in front of your eyes. You have a video with the president saying something which is very clear to everyone but you still claim that he did not say what it is he said.
Get help!
The republicans cut off what he said before that line. He started off saying that nobody makes it completely on their own, and as an example he said that the government system and tax payers put in place a society ( with laws, police, public education, roads, highways, bridges, satilites used by private industry, thr world wide web develooed by nasa and the militery and handed to private industry to orofit from,ect. And then he said that the business owners did not pay for those things by themselves. The repubs cut that out in order to fool people like you. Now think about this….think of some big corporations, Johnson & Johnson, catipiller, auto industry, apple, IBM, AT&T, tmobile, wells Fargo, bank of America, and so on and so on. They set up their private businesses using government investments. They didn’t spend any money developing a judicial system that would protect the contracts they signed, they didn’t develope and sent up satilites, they didn’t, on their own initiative using their money build roads, highways, bridges. The government did that. The government made the investments needed for private people to set up businesses, and more investments that guaranteed them that customers would be available to them. Now it has always been a given that when someone makes an investment, they should be compensated for that, private industry certainly expects to be compensated for their investments. Now remember when we talk about the government, we are talking about the people who have lived and now live in America. When we talk about investments, we are talking about our tax dollars, spent for the purpose to give opportunity to its citizens. Reagan was wrong….government is not and never was the “problem”. For the people, by the people. THE GOVERNMENT IS US.
Another great one Mario!!! : ) Sharing on your album Political Illustrations of Mario Piperni on The Platzner Post https://www.facebook.com/ThePlatznerPost
What Fox does here with two little girls is beyond stupidity!
redState girl,
It is so obvious that you are here trolling the libs (get them agitated for sport). You get the idea that the line is taken out of context with the intent of distorting the President’s words for a soundbite. You also have seen the clips of Romney saying exactly the same thing during the Olympics in Utah. It is called POLITICS, not to be confused with POLICY. I doubt you are that stupid.
This is a non issue, whipped up to reinforce the conservative narrative that Obama is a Socialist. Well, you know what, I am fine with you people thinking that. If you really think Romney will be better for the middle class, VOTE FOR THE DOUCHE BAG – just like you voted for the village idiot W.
But when you do, do us all a favor and don’t blame Democrats for the fucked economy like you are now with Obama. Instead, activate whatever cognitive abilities you possess and put the blame where it belongs: the Republican Party – the anti-Socialist, Darwinian, Libertarian, sink-or-swim party of the Plutocracy.
Trickle Down might seem alright until you realize that warm, wet feeling is the Republican Party PISSING ON YOUR FOOT!
Have a nice day redState girl !!!
OC…..maybe when these republican supporters end up working for $3.00/hr, and are living under our crumbling bridges with their uneducated, hungry children, they will listen to their GOP leaders proudly brag the the USA is the wealthiest nation on the globe and they will realize that they were duped.
Bravo, Sydney.
Unfortunately, it will be too late.
No, Sydney, they never will. They willl be told it was the fault of birth control, abortions, gay marriage, equal rights, etc. – and they, like redstategirl, will believe it.
How interesting that not one of you libs have anything to say about the actual words Obama said as quoted by Redstategirl. “If you got a business, you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.”
Seems pretty clear to most of us what it was the president was saying. A little honesty on the part of liberals would go a long way in bridging the divide between left and right. Give it a go. You might even learn that factual honesty could sometimes be your friend.
Cheryl you are probley correct. When I read posts on various sites that are frequented by teapots, I have been noticing them telling others how lucky they are to have found a part time minimum wage job. They will say that they thank god for this blessing because there a so many people who can’t find a job at all. So…….just like the conservatives have convinced us that mass shooting with automatic weapons, is just something that happens once in a while, and there will always be some crazy people that will commit these crimes, many people have started to accept these incidences as common place and there is nothing we can do about it as this is the price we, as Americans, pay for FREEDOM. A future republican government will convince their sheep that, by god, they are lucky to get that poverty level job! People in china are only making $1.40/hr, so god bless America…..your making $3.00!!! The repubs have an amazing ability to control the conversation, or lack there of, and there is no limit to the uneducated, gullible and racist Americans that will believe their crap. I think we just might be up shits creek.
Marcus
The word THAT refers to the previous remark regarding this society that had been created through government projects and Americans tax dollars.
Example…
If Obama said ” the republicans in congress refuse to extend tax relief for the middle class, so what the republicans are saying to the American people is this…………everyone’s taxes will go up, your government does not care about your plight, tuff luck to 99% of the population, just tighten your belts”
Ok now…….
The GOP would replay over and over Obama only speaking speaking the following ” EVERYONE’S taxes will go up, your government does not care about your plight, tuff luck to the 99% of the population, just tighten your belts”
And your OK with this misleading bullshite?
“Misleading” is in the eye of the beholder. I understand full well why you would interpret the president’s words as you have but you should be aware that you are making an assumption. Obama is your guy and you choose to give him the benefit of the doubt as to what he meant by “that”. Very well. As an independent, I see it differently.
@Marcus. You didn’t listen to the actual speech – only what Fox took out of context. He was talking about the infrastructure. You have to get off Fox to hear the real stuff.
WOW, Marcus D –
OK, let’s say Obama said what you think ( I think he was talking about the importance of community and society as an institution). How do you respond to Romney making the same statement at the Olympics?
Though I salute the many friends on this site’s steadfast defense of the President, Marcus and Redstate girl are right about one thing .. he did speak those words.
That being said, anyone paying attention to the political campaign’s of both party’s would instinctively know the President was giving a, less than eloquent version (by his standards), of Elizabeth Warren’s now well known speech which went viral on youtube.
In which she points out that America is “indivisble” and therefore the rich, the poor, the middle class – all are helped by someone, some organization and many times by our government. To deny THAT is “delusional”.
For anyone to grasp on to a few words, clearly taken out of context, and make a national campaign about it, speaks volumes of how divisive our politics has become and the lack of substance some people are willing to accept.
It is always a wonder to me how Republicans could go from believing as Lincoln when he said government “is BY the people FOR the people… and shall not perish” – to believing that “government” is an evil entity to be “drowned in a bathtub”.
All of us must continue to realize, that this election is truly about the FUTURE we want for our country.
Yes we ALL say we want it to be prosperous and strong and “exceptional”, but how do we get there?
By throwing our poor. disabled, seniors and children under the bus along with much of the middle class, to give more to the rich ? That approach has shown to be a major FAILURE, not only in the US but in Europe….
or to build from the middle class out – as we have successfully done in the past, by providing them the tools necessary that will eventually enrich ALL of our citizens and make our Nation strong.
Fighting over a few words while faced with THAT decision… seems small in comparison.
By the way, Marcus D, You aren’t an Independent. People who support the idea of Democrats being taken out of context in an effort to prove they are Socialists are called CONSERVATIVES. But thanks for playing our game. Enjoy the Rice-a-Roni.
I listened to the speech. The conservatives present a theory, then they must invent evidence to promote their theory.
Obama was going to take everyone’s guns. Oh, that didn’t happen? Well if he gets a second term that’s when he will do it. Obama wants to become a dictator, is a Muslim, he is ashamed of America, he had an apology tour, he hates business, he hates Americans, his goal is to destroy this country, I could go on and on. All of these conspiracy theories never came to pass. Obama is what he is, an intelligent, thoughtful man who want the best for the people who elected him. He takes his job seriously, thinks before he acts, and makes decisions based on reality.
Now do you really believe that he slipped up and let the real Obama shine through, his devious plan accidentally exposed for all to see? The man was the head of the Harvard law review. Bush was such a dunce that they were able to print over 4 books that documented his bushisims. I was embarrassed for him just watching the word salad that tumbled from his mouth. Romney….I like firing people…..I’m not concerned about the very poor….and Ann Romney…..we have given you PEOPLE all you need to know about our finances. We are the people. In 2009 over 30,000 citizens were given amnesty when they were caught and charged with tax evasion for money placed in Swiss bank accounts. Could that be the reason he won’t release his tax records?this country is so divided that Romney could bite the eyeball out of a infant at one of his rally’s, and. That would be OK.
Well said, GoldenSun. Thank you for clarifying the intent of the President’s statement which was taken out of context. Also, I agree with you about the future we want for this country — for everyone to have an equal opportunity to prosper. “Trickle Down” economics doesn’t work — the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, and the middle class disappear altogether.
When Bush took office we had a budget surplus. When he left office, our economy was in the toilet — due largely to a lengthy drawn out war started over a false premise. Despite roadblocks thrown into his path by the GOP at every turn, President Obama has steadfastly worked toward righting those wrongs and getting the country back on its feet since he took office. This country can’t survive another hit like it took during the Bush years, so I will be casting my vote again for Barack Obama in 2012!
I want to jump back in here and remind everyone that we don’t have to go back as far as the Olympics…after Romney condemned the President as “FOREIGN” for his ALLEGED words, he went on, in the very same stump speech, to AGREE with all that the President ACTUALLY said…too bad no one in the audience had seen the President’s remarks and could realize their candidate’s concession.
Sydney…”Obama is what he is….” and he wants the BEST FOR ALL THE PEOPLE (remember when he said “to those of you who didn’t vote for me, I’ll be YOUR President too”), not just the ones who elected him. He knows full well that if the “working people” (currently referred to as the “middle class”) do well, if the economy grows from the bottom up (currently described as the “middle out”), EVEN THE WEALTHY make more money.
It appears we’ve lost redState girl…sadly, she’s missed much wisdom in the recent comments. If her goal was to rile up, cudos to her. The byproduct is to cement our support for the President, to remind ourselves to do MORE of what we can to assure this President has a second term…then think hard about who will follow him…this mess won’t be over for years to come unless we keep supporting our POLICIES, knowing that they are all that stands between US and PLUTOCRACY…we must, for posterity AND the future, stand strong to rebuild this nation on progressive values.
WOW! OC , just wow!
I don’t know if Mario has a rule against posting urls from news sites, but the adult version of FOX’s “ain’t kids as cute as kittens”, approach to economics is at Alternet “5 Reasons the Super-Rich Need Government More Than the Rest of Us” is a good source of info about how the richest corporations benefit from society and who pays the bills for it all.
http://www.alternet.org/story/156413/5_reasons_the_super-rich_need_government_more_than_the_rest_of_us?akid=9111.55684.Gt6W5v&rd=1&t=8
Even that guy in New Hampshire that Romney used, Jack Gilchrist, admits to having had government help. Here is the information:
In 1999, Gilchrist Metal received $800,000 in tax-exempt revenue bonds issued by the New Hampshire Business Finance Authority “to set up a second manufacturing plant and purchase equipment to produce high definition television broadcasting equipment,” according to a New Hampshire Union Leader report at the time…
Last year, Gilchrist Metal also received two U.S. Navy sub-contracts totaling about $83,000 and a smaller $5,600 Coast Guard contract in 2008, according to a government web site that tracks spending.
Gilchrist wisely took advantage of these funds, which help small businesses like his survive in their early years. He also took a U.S. Small Business Administration loan in the late 1980s totaling “somewhere south of” $500,000, plus matching funds from the federally-funded New England Trade Adjustment Assistance Center.
In a lesson on basic government spending that Romney himself could learn from, Gilchrist succinctly explained: “I’m not going to turn a blind eye because the money came from the government. As far as I’m concerned, I’m getting some of my tax money back. I’m not stupid, I’m not going to say ‘no.’ Shame on me if I didn’t use what’s available.”
In other words, he didn’t do it himself. He had government help. He didn’t build it alone..
So tell me, redState girl – If the Presiden is a liar, is Romney not also a liar? Is Gilchrist a hypocrite for appearing in that commercial and saying what he did? Are you not a parrot sounding off with Fox News talking points? Does the Republican Party and their supporters have a flaming case of ODS because there’s a
niblack man in thewoodpiWhite HouseLet me add that I’ve been involved with OFA from the start…and urge those of you here who yearn for a second term to contact your state OFA representatives and offer your support and some of your time to the ’12 campaign….visit barackobama.com or OrganizingforAmerica.com for contacts. Your articulateness and passion can help this President WIN.
I now live, as an adopted “native”, in the Wild and Wonderful state of WV…the slogan speaks the truth…”wonderful” in the bounty of her natural beauty, “wild” when talking guns, race, LIBERTY or FREEDOM.
We are considered a “border state”, along with all the others surrounding “the 12″ or “the 9″…whatever number you consider to be the battleground. (Don’t tell anyone but, our D voters, at upwards of 40%, in the recent primary, voted to elect a convicted felon currently incarcerated in TX, who has run before on other ballots, rather than support Obama…I’ll let you conclude as you will but hint that he’s not BLACK, MUSLIM or NAZI…).
Rest assured there is a “small but mighty” group of dedicated Progressives, even Liberals, among the Dem voters in our state. Some of us are working hard making voter calls into Ohio…I find voters are discouraged and disheartened…even the President admits he didn’t do a good enough job of telling the STORY of what and why he pursues the policies he has…or how it RELATES personally to OUR lives….none of the Dems did WELL ENOUGH at countering the R SPIN.
Making calls can be frustrating, irritating and REWARDING…for those voters who WANT to support a second term and yet, feel the President hasn’t done enough for them, we need to listen, remind them of what he HAS been able to accomplish for THEM and provide support before we ask for their support in Nov. We’re using a highly efficient (consider the source) online system…you can call in your undies with a “cup of Joe”, at your convenience…stop and start as your busy schedule allows.
PLEASE CONSIDER JOINING US…YOUR VOICE COULD MAKE ALL THE DIFFERENCE.
One more thing…a friend emailed a link to Mario…I was blown away by the talent in the illustrations and find comfort in (most of) the words here…thank you all for allowing me to bust into your conversations.
Running a lemonade stand doesn’t take government help Kilmeade! Fox and Friends is the dumbest show on that “news” network,and that’s saying a lot.
“…thank you all for allowing me to bust into your conversations.”
Welcome aboard, Carol. Happy to have you here.
Thanks Mario…and you don’t mind that I did some shameless promotion of OFA? ; )
Carol, you’re free to promote OFA any time you wish.
You “should” check out my friend, Chris Savage’s blog, eclectablog.com…especially after today’s conversation.
Find this entry….Romney resorts to Breitbart-style editing in latest attack against Obama (UPDATED x2)
Videos included.
Carol, I think you’re great ! May there be many, many more like you !
Thanks so much GS….I’ll pop in as often as possible. I “lurk” at and support a couple of blogs and seldom enter the conversations because my time is limited but it felt right jumping in here.
I’ll bet tomorrow we’ll be talking about the President’s Urban League speech…where he mentioned, wait for it…… GUNS.
It’s the “Romper Room Kids” & I’m not talking about the two little girls.
redState girl – I believe that liberals make economic decisions based on a false premise. They believe that the economy starts with consumers. They believe that if the government gives money to consumers, companies will have more customers, and will therefore have a reason to expand.
It’s that single belief that guides them to redistribute wealth. It’s the reason they want to take more from the rich and give it to the poor. They think that the economy starts with money magically appearing in someone’s pocket.
I know, as do most small business owners, that the economy starts with someone creating a product or service that they can market and sell. They create the demand for their businesses with advertising. They don’t wait for customers to come, they pull them in. They create demand, they don’t wait for demand.
Every individual is a small business too. They market their time and skills to potential employers until someone agrees to pay the individual’s asking price. Employers are customers of the employee.
Small businesses contract with vendors to supply them with the raw materials they need to deliver what they’re offering to their customers. The “help” that was given by those vendors to the business owner, was voluntarily provided by each of them so they could earn a profit. They didn’t do it on behalf of some “social contract”.
Tax revenues are only generated when there’s profit. When my company makes a profit, I pay taxes. My employees pay taxes on the profits they receive from supplying my company with their time and skills.
It’s the profits that result from the use of sound business practices that generate the tax revenues that pay for the roads and bridges that are used to transport all of this commerce. The government doesn’t provide services out of some sense of compassion. We buy the products that they’re selling. Every service provided by a teacher, a policeman, or a fireman, is bought and paid for out of the profits generated in a free market environment.
The economy starts with people who create demand for what they’re selling. To tell people anything else, robs them of any hope that they can do anything to change their situation. It then becomes easy for governmental entrepreneurs, (who just want to increase their own market share), to feed the people hope with a promise that they’ll work to take from the rich, and give to them.
As long as people keep making economic decisions based on incorrect assumptions, the economy will suffer.
Dear Mr. Pane, good to hear from you again ! I must rebut your post by saying:
Talk about incorrect assumptions, your whole diatribe started out with the false assumption that
“the government GIVES money to consumers”. Where did that come from?
You confuse the “starting of a business” with “stimulating” the economy. Something that would benefit all businesses.
I’m all for small businesses and I often wish the big conglomerates would be replaced by more of them, – but the economy is not suffering from a LACK of people wanting to sell something to them.
The problem is these businesses that originated in the US, that accepted government help with loans, with subsidies, with tax cuts, with favorable regulation and many other things that help them establish themselves and become successful now multi-national corporations, started taking advantage of all the above.
While all assumed they would create jobs in America and help the economy, they now outsource their jobs because of cheaper labor and MORE profits.
They now abuse the tax laws and actually pay our politicians to create even more favorable laws, to the point where total tax evasion has become legal.
So all those “raw materials, vendors and tax revenues and jobs”, now go to a foreign country. And though there are still many places of businesses here, the ever growing number of (150 million estimated) American potential workers are left to “market” themselves to fewer and fewer of them and, as we know, many are left without.
Those that are lucky enough to have jobs find that (as economy 101 tells us) the more supply of workers there is the less demand for them there is and the cheaper the price for American workers will become. Thus more and more Americans work for minimum wage.
This results in the national “consumer” having less to spend on the products you sell, which may mean you may have to sell those products at a cheaper rate, which means less profits for you which means less taxes going to “Build” those roads, bridges and other infrastructure.
I don’t know what you “produce” or how large your “small business” may be, but this President has provided many incentives to keep you profitable.
Your hatred of paying taxes, however seems more of a principle ideology of yours, than any physical effect on your own personal profits.
You and I agree on one thing however – “As long as people keep making economic decisions based on incorrect assumptions, the economy will suffer.”
Tommy
I am a small business owner. Have been for over 25 years. Meat industry. Highly regulated business. I know MANY other business owners. Business owners are friends of mine. EVERY SINGLE ONE would tell you that without customers….you got nothing. You can make a wonderful product! You can advertise your product! People will find that they DON’T WANT TO LIVE without your product!, until they, themselves, lose their jobs, homes, and security and they HAVE to live without your product. Even APPLE will one day find that the customers who lost their revenue due to job loss, will discover that can live without that $500. IPhone.
You don’t know what your talking about tommy. You drank the koolaid and that koolaid filled your brain to the point that reasonable thought cannot exist. When people lose their jobs and their wallets do not contain the disposable cash that it once did, they spend just what they need to survive. Most families will not use the republican theory of economics. A family of four in which the parents lost their jobs would look desperately for new revenue, and unlike the conservative ideology of cutting expenses by cutting Medicare, education funding, social security, public service workers, the parents WILL NOT try to fix their finances by getting rid of their children (kids cost alot of money tommy),sell their furniture, car, televisions and just try to hang on to their home by their fingernails. They will try their best to bring in new revenue.
No business owner ever made a decision based on their tax rates. I paid more in taxes then most people made in a year. 23-30 thousand. I moved into a bigger building, hired more help, invested in the stock market and real estate.
After the republican ideology crashed the economy in 08, my customers were hit hard. At first they continued to come weekly, but spent less money, then they visited monthly and spent even less money. I looked to move to a smaller, cheaper building and let go of my employees. Then many of my customers lost their homes, moved away, and I never saw them again. The business that I had run so profitably for decades is a shadow of its former self.
Ayn Rand wrote fiction tommy. A woman who railed against the government her entire life, used Medicare and SS, under a different name at the end of her life.
Although I would like to believe that the government spend money on public education, infrasture, medical research, technical research (which in many cases they turned over to private entities for personal profit), did these things solely out if compassion I realize that the government borrowed money and did these things as an investment.
The judicial and legal system which allowed me to enforce signed contracts is an investment they made that benefits me. This democracy which was an experiment of government run by, and representing its citizens was very successful. We did amazing things, wonderful things, we built the Hoover dam, interstate highways, jet engines, satilites, the world wide web. The bones of this country was an investment by the people living here for the people yet to be born. The government doesn’t deserve a return on its investment by all who profit from it?
Your vision of how the economy works is a fallacy, and I would imagine that you would have to see it fail with your own eyes to realize that.
EXCELLENT POST SYDNEY !!!